Dawn of Warhammer 40,000: Firestorm Over Kaurava

The definitive Table Top conversion mod for Dawn of War.
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 Post subject: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 5:51 am 
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Ok, i know you all say we can't model things in dawn of war 2.

what im saying: is that strictly true?

this thread is for the research required to be able to do it.

im sure there's some obscure way of doing it as the models are made with the havok engine. am i correct?

because there are stuff you can download for the havok engine for max that's limited but you can still do quite a bit with it.

if it turns out to be possible, it would restore a lot of enthusiam for dawn of war 2 and yup, you gessed it, Dow40k: 2 (i forgotten the solar system name in dow2 :p)

a general pointer direction. info on the file formats used, asociable programs that can open and edit them.

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 6:26 am 
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It took place in the Aurelia sector if I am correct. (Probably not what you wanted to hear in your first response...)

Simply put, I just don't really think that modding DoW2 will work out. It's a signifigantly different game to the first, not to mention the differences between gameplay styles. (One's a spam affair, whilest the other is small tactical precision.)

EDIT: Sorry then. I'll take my business elsewhere Gorb. 8-)

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Last edited by Des Major on Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:44 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 6:40 am 
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Des Major, please, don't showcase your ignorance in here. The DoW 2 engine is incredibly more advanced than the DoW 1 engine, and the most obvious example of that is the RBF code itself. What you can do with the code alone beggars belief.

Now, for the information:

1. The GUI is hardcoded in Scaleform, modification of this is extremely unlikely if not possible (people may already know this, however I'm just listing everything I know).

2. http://www.modsrus.com/?p=43

3. You can find out a lot of existing constraints through hex editing, and hex editing already allows you to add/edit textures on existing models, thus creating "new" unit types if those unit types only require a reskinning to work.

4. DoW 2 uses five layers of texture maps, and each model is separated into head/backpack, torso, weapon and limb meshes (to the best of my knowledge). The Havoc toolset then appends these meshes to the animation skeleton. An incredibly neat way of making models work, if you ask me, as you can update a lot of models' animations by merely tweaking one skeleton.

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 7:28 pm 
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4.
from what i saw of the havok tools for 3ds max half a year ago is that there was a built in layer manager where you could load up meshes in that similar way. perhaps they did the same and saved it as file.

i'd need to investigate further into that.

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:24 am 
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Just to give a quick personal opinion on this new project:

1-There was still plenty of work and potential in the original DoW.
2-DoW FoKed was heavy computer wise. DoW II Foked will be plain unplayable in most machines out there, since there's not even a cheap graphics option.
3-Altough the new engine is indeed full of potential, well, I can't stop thinking there are other engines out there wich could have worked better. Just to "fix" the SP campaign you'll need to redo almost everything from scratch. Seems like a lot of work to me that could have been avoided.

But well, it's Mirage's Knight and Horus time and effort, and they decide where to put it. I won't forget the wondrous things you did with FoK. Good luck with this project and stuff, altough I won't bother following it untill I get a new better computer, wich shouldn't happen in a couple of years.


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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 5:38 pm 
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They're not quitting FoK....

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 8:48 pm 
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General, Onard didn't say that. I think he merely believes Horus' (and whoever else who is active on the FoK team and working on this DoW 2 project) time is better off spent working on FoK.

@ Onard:

1. You might be surprised, but there isn't. Soulstorm offers quite a lot in the way of coding tweaks, but a lot of the actual limitations present in the DC engine are also present in the Soulstorm engine. Furthermore, there are only two more races to "FoK up"; the previous seven races have already been implemented and will just need testing and balancing with regards to the new races.

2. Only with regards to loading times. Performance wise it's not that bad - DoW is a very dated engine and only machines purchased around the time of Winter Assault's release will have real trouble coping with the strain that even FoK puts a processor under.

3. The FoK team are familiar with the DoW engine, and the Essence engine, at least visually, is a reinvention of that engine. Moving to another game would mean re-learning a lot of things from scratch. Do you mind listing some of these "other engines out there"?

As for fixing the SP Campaign . . . it only really needs fixing. Nothing needs redoing from scratch, and indeed redoing the Campaign from the ground up is impossible anyhow. Just because you don't like the way the Campaign feels currently doesn't mean everyone else doesn't like it either :)

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2009 12:40 am 
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Quote:
1-There was still plenty of work and potential in the original DoW.


work yes, potential no. believe me when i say this.

i have modded the game since 06. i have coded several mods and side projects that i care to forget about and added a lot of FX and models to the game.

i can say for sure about 98% of the things you can do ingame have been done by some team or another and even ive already found stuff and showed others. anything that i could of learned from the DoW engine has been learned, except scar code and UI but coding never bothered me much anyway and fuggles for one has likely done everything with it.

adding the models to the game is now work as ive done it several times now. i no longer find any satisfaction from doing it.

everything you can possibly do in regard to the object editor ive likely done as well.

you know i am pretty much the only person to publicly speak up and say " here look what i can do with this great tool" and show people how to randomise the army painter models and even the main menu screen commanders. no other mod that ive seen and came across has never done this, and i've browsed several mods to see what ideas and inspiration i can draw upon from them. i wouldn't have gotten where i am now without it.

Quote:
2-DoW FoKed was heavy computer wise. DoW II Foked will be plain unplayable in most machines out there, since there's not even a cheap graphics option.


dow of war has a lot things that could be improved upon, which is likely corrected now with dow 2.

for one the textures weren't shared. everything even if it was on another model had its own texture space. in dawn of war 2 this is likely corrected because everything is commonly shared so its easily manageable. all the marines for example have the same textures.

as for computer wise, its insanely cheap to get a decent pc now. mine cost around 300 and ive got an asus m4n87 pro motherboard (arround £100) an nvidia geforce 9800 for the same price and the few bits on bobs like the hard drive for like 30 each and then the cpu which i got on offer, an amd phenom 2 x550 black ed. which is an awesome cpu still.

300-£400 is very easy money on a full time job.

that aside, most people running dow 2 likely has a similar or even better set up. no real problems there.

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:49 am 
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My bad. Misinterpretation FTL.

@ Horus- So, it's the same name, new game idea, ehh? I dig it. While Chaos Rising looks insanely legit, Chaos Rising with a touch of Horus would be legit beyond comprehension, should you decide to spread your modding taint along those serrated bowels of computerisms. Inspiration, yar!

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:56 pm 
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so after the next version of FOK is done u will be working on DOW2 am i correct?
or after the next realease is there more stuff 2 add?

and yeh DOW2 would be good modded :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 10:58 am 
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ok, heres some interesting things to be looked into:
http://www.daksystems.net/blog2/?p=108
http://bulletphysics.org/Bullet/phpBB3/ ... =12&t=2218

the HKX files, notably the physics behavior files.

possible converters to make your own and such.

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 1:05 pm 
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look everyone who is complaining

DOW2 modding is very possible - DOW took time to work out, atm they are switching heads on units and adding new feet, if they can do that they are getting gradually closer to being able to mod properly - look at the Imperial Guard mod by xaero - not much but he has made a new race, added stormtroopers, gave them the ability to build concrete walls, added imperial guard, added a stormblade (predator with a plasma cannon) so things look good - that was all last year february, what are they doing now? there were no DOW mod tools until winter assault was released, now give me a second while i change my signature since i have nothing there...

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 Post subject: Re: Dawn Of War 2 Mod research.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 3:33 pm 
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we were able to get models in game a little while after my last post...

so yours is pretty much irrelevant.

locking for for now. any problems send a pm.

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