Dawn of Warhammer 40,000: Firestorm Over Kaurava

The definitive Table Top conversion mod for Dawn of War.
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 Post subject: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:45 pm 
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guess what.

the UI is hardcoded by tier! so if you want to put your tier level 2 unit in tier 2 but no room in the ui for it, it has to be tier 3! :evil: etc.

i only just found that out after trying to get stikkbommas and flashgitz to show up in the right places for ages ¬¬

so far i do not see any reason why that should be. the old ui system worked fine as is.
what is going on here relic? what was the reasoning behind that?

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:14 pm 
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You expect an answer from Relic on here, of all places?

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:18 pm 
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no. ofcourse not.that last sentence is whats called Rambling.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:32 pm 
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Completely off-topic, but Led Zep are awesome.

Anyhow. If there's no room for the unit on the UI . . . then what's the difference from DoW 1? Instead of it not showing up at all, you just have to move it to a different Tier?

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:40 pm 
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**** Relic and their stupid DoW2. Besides that - **** Microsoft & Games for Windows Live. As I understand, most of our problems with hardcoded engine comes from license agreement between THQ (Relic) & MS of GFWL use.
I hope that Relic will correct their mistakes in DOW3 + use Relic Online instead of GFWL. Until then I'll stick to DoW1.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:26 pm 
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at first its really confusing, as its not all one thing, its in sections.

so one part could be section 1 and then has 5 rows in it, for example

the squad selection is ordered: with tier 1 being part 1, tier 2 being 5 etc.

1: 12345
5: 12345
7: 12345

if an object requires tier two, then it has to go into tier two or higher.
the problem arises mainly when you have several units in the same tier, the ui space becomes really limited. your forced to put them in another building (not likely in dow 2) or put them in another tier.
the weapon upgrades to the side is like this which is a different part altogether:

123
456
789

i havent even scratched the ability ui spaces, but they are seperate too.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 5:52 pm 
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@ megazogg: completely incorrect on every level. That's all I'll say on that particular topic, to avoid dragging this off-topic.

@ Horus: I haven't had much of a look at the UI and how it works, though I have heard it is extremely confusing. If you ask me we should hammer out what spaces are represented by what number - AFAIK there isn't a definitive listing for DoW 2 as of yet.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 5:28 pm 
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have you considered doing this through sub menus? eg. splitting it into fast attack, heavy support etc...

this would probably require a radical restructuring of how the building/research works in DoW2, but lets see.

http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?t=211532

essentially, this is done through upgrades and abilties - all the units/items/upgrades on screen 1 require upgrade A,B &C not to be present in order to be displayed. then all of your units in fast attack require upgrade A to be present to be displayed, and so on a so forth. the back button (also an upgrade) would simply remove upgrade A, restoring the menu to its original

so your main building screen would consist of 3 ability buttons which give upgrades A, B & C, and then these all have a back button ability which removes the upgrades showing the default screen again

so assuming the HQ build menu is a 4x3 square (can't remember, don't have DoW2 installed so using COH standard for this) you have you 4 unit menus at the top bar, 4 upgrade menus on the middle bar, and then you have upto 4 tiers to be researched on the bottom bar. tiers in this case would be a simple player upgrade rather than anything major changing the ui setup or whatever, much like the wehrmacht 'phase' sytem in CoH.

using this method, you could have upto 96 slots (adjusting for the acutal UI size of the HQ) for units & upgrades run over 4 tiers.

is this doable in DOW2? its not really something i've looked into, it kind of falls apart if you are unable to assign abilities to the build menu of the HQ. one assumes you can, since this was the function of the british HQ truck deployments in CoH, so i would be suprised if this removed. but i need to install DOW2 again at somepoint and get my feet wet

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 5:46 pm 
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im not sure whether that's possible, i havent seen all the extension data, and the coding style is completely different and more horrible looking than the previous code you see there.

without a proper clean editor interface to use that simplifies the look of everything it would be hard to do at least.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:21 pm 
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I will be trying to ask some modding-related questions this Friday when I preview Chaos Rising. One of those questions will be to ask for at least some of Relic's LUA files (apparently they still use LUA) so we can see how they work.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:33 pm 
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well, whether its rgb or rbf, they will simply be encoded .lua files.

corsix mod tools was able to dump encoded rgd files to lua, so we might not even need them from relic once someone comes up with a decoder (which i believe that's in progress now)

the lua code its self is irrlevant, however, that's simply a template for a blank ability which has an action which gives the player an upgrade. the ability requires this upgrade not to present to display, thereby disabling itself (and other 'menu button' abilities). this player upgrade is a requirement for the units in this catagory to be displayed, thereby revealing them. in this new menu, there is another ability, a 'back button', which removes the player upgrade, thereby undoing all the changes and reverting back to the original menu.

essentially all the abilities, units and upgrades are overlapping each other but are invisible, these abilities simply toggle their visibility on and off

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 9:16 pm 
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Khorney wrote:
corsix mod tools was able to dump encoded rgd files to lua, so we might not even need them from relic once someone comes up with a decoder (which i believe that's in progress now)

the lua code its self is irrlevant, however, that's simply a template for a blank ability which has an action which gives the player an upgrade.
There is already a RBF - .txt converter, it's been out for ages. The problem is we don't know how inheritance works, and how/if MetaData tags are used (which go hand in hand with inheritance to some extent).

So yes, an actual LUA file would be useful. I've been talking this through with other DoW 1 modders looking to transition to DoW 2, and the consensus is some example LUA files would be handy.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:23 pm 
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when it comes to the specifics of DOW2 modding, i'm talking out my ass so fair enough =P

i was working under the assumption people had figured out how to edit and add new abilities and upgrades given the mods out currently, so i figured the same logic from CoH would apply here, as its an engine revision closer to DoW2 from DoW1

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:07 am 
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finally got round to installing DOW2, loaded up a modstudio, had a look around

upon a cursory glance, it looks like this is doable. i will see if i can get a working prototype for you to play around with

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 6:40 pm 
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Just to add an idea for Horus...

There are 4-5 slots in each Tier on the HQ building for units. However, on the commander, there is 12 slots, I think. What about the HQ holding some basic units and the ability to build new buildings that just appear directly (and automatically) adjacent to the HQ (Like an unmovable unit). Those new buildings can have build menus that are the size of the commander's build menu, which would in turn produce units. Those new units could come out of the new structure or the HQ.

Just a thought.


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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 12:57 am 
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i thought this little system we've cooked up for our mod based on what i posted earlier would be relevant to your interests ;) :

http://www.filefront.com/17551107/dow2- ... 35-57.mkv/

if it doesn't make any sense, its essentially got 5 different buttons for each FoC section, which you select, opening a new menu. this then adds a 'back' button in the corner, which you click to restore the 5 categories. i've cooked up some icons for it and i'll update the post when that vid is ready

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 2:40 am 
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that would be awesome. post up the code so i blag it and work it ingame :D

Though when i can get skirmish working stupid updates >_<

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 4:21 am 
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Horus wrote:
Though when i can get skirmish working stupid updates >_<

did you do like the message on the bottom at the main menu says? to disable your mic in control panel.




:D

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Last edited by Chompster on Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: UI failure? you decide!
PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:59 pm 
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wot you chatting about lol

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